http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/forum/how-much-should-i-charge The Community for Working Musicians en-US Sat, 11 Feb 2012 09:00:02 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/search.php http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/salary-requirements-in-job-postings#post-1880 Thu, 09 Feb 2012 03:25:13 +0000 Cameron Mizell 1880@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I always try to give a flat rate. I also think most people believe you get what you pay for. If you bid too low, you might give the impression that you're not good enough for the job. If somebody is actually trying to pay you as little as possible, then it's probably not a gig worth your time, anyway.</p> <p>The union rates are a good place to start figuring your prices, but there are a lot of gigs that simply won't pay that much but are still worth doing for other reasons.</p> <p>One of my friends pointed out that every gig has three factors:</p> <p>- The Music<br /> - The Money<br /> - The Hang</p> <p>If you can get two out of three, that's a gig worth doing!</p> <p>I also think about how much time I'll have to invest preparing for the gig.</p> <p>For example, if somebody would like to hire me to play guitar for them, this is what I want to know:</p> <p><ul><li>How many songs will I need to learn?</li><li>Will there be charts or do I have to learn the music by ear?</li><li>Do I have to memorize everything?</li><li>How many rehearsals?</li><li>How many instruments am I playing?</li><li>Is there going to be a backline or do I have to bring my gear?</li><li>Is this for one performance, or will there be gigs in the future playing the same material?</li><br /> </ul></p> <p>Experience has taught me to ask these questions. I've learned how much time it takes me to prepare for a gig based on how much material is provided and what is expected.</p> <p>The irony, of course, is that gigs that will provide professional charts, tracks, and backline at the rehearsal and gig always pay more than those that send you a bunch of YouTube links, need you to spend all week transcribing and memorizing songs, and then need you to haul your gear to multiple rehearsals and the gig.</p> <p>Finally, try to learn what you can about the actual budget. I once got a gig that paid really well. I got all the answers to my questions above, and it was going to be a pretty easy gig--show up with my guitar, play some charts, go home. Then I get to the venue and realize it's a huge party for celebrities and NYC's upper crust. I also figured out I was the lowest paid person in the band! It was still a great gig and good money, but had my negotiating skills been better, I would have been able to earn more. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1807 Sun, 22 Jan 2012 09:59:34 +0000 JilinPA 1807@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Hi Everyone!<br /> I just found this website this morning and already love it! I usually do not take part in forums, but when I found this one I knew I just had to register!<br /> I work in the activities dept in a nursing home that has locations all over the place, and have to say you have been given great advice. We have paid musicians anywhere from 50-150 per hour, but I am sure you could get more at an assisted living/ind.living facility like where my husband works.<br /> I am a musician myself (pianist), and after learning/observing the other musicians doing this I think I am gonna give it a try.<br /> I am just not sure how to report the income at tax time, so I could use some advice if anyone has that experience thanks! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/salary-requirements-in-job-postings#post-1800 Fri, 20 Jan 2012 13:22:18 +0000 Higgs 1800@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I've had both very good and very bad experiences with this type of thing. When I had just moved to New York, I got an orchestration job and the producer asked me to name my fee. I had no idea what to ask for, so I had a high ball figure, and a figure about 35% lower, which I was willing to settle for. We met for lunch, and I hit him with my high ball. I thought he was going to say "What? Are you crazy?!". But what he actually said was "Oh dear God, that's not nearly enough.", and offered me 25% more, which was twice as much as the fee I was willing to settle for. If only all negotiations went like that!</p> <p>On the flip side, I had a phone interview last year to MD a show. 3 weeks of rehearsals plus 3 weeks of shows. This was a medium-sized and well established company, so I felt comfortable asking for $500 a week for rehearsals and $125 per show (which is a bargain!). They were flabbergasted, and said they only had $500 TOTAL for the entire thing. It was a show I really wanted to do, so I said I'd do the whole shebang for $1500 (less than half of what I'd asked for), but they wouldn't budge an inch. I did not do the show. </p> <p>At this point, being a non-union musician, I quote them the union rate and see what they say. The ball should be in their court. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/salary-requirements-in-job-postings#post-1799 Fri, 20 Jan 2012 12:24:03 +0000 funkyguitar 1799@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I responded to a Craigslist posting a few months ago where this came up. The post was from a restaurant that was looking for musical entertainment, and they requested a price quote. What it seemed to come down to for them as to what to pay is what was in their budget. I asked for $75 for a 2.5 hour gig, but they said they could only afford $50, plus a sandwich and a couple of glasses of wine. That was fine with me (this was in Portland, OR by the way). The place was somewhat deserted, I don't think there were more than 2 or 3 tables occupied at any point in the evening, and at times the place was completely empty. I felt respected, the owners were very nice and asked that I get back in touch with them when I'm back in town after my cruise line gig. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/salary-requirements-in-job-postings#post-1798 Fri, 20 Jan 2012 00:30:45 +0000 NateOMatic 1798@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I've found it's comparatively rare in our field for a job posting to ask for "salary requirements", but sometimes it does happen. How do you all go about deciding what to quote? I'm not necessarily asking for specific numbers (unless you feel it's helpful to share).</p> <p>Do you give a salary range or a more specific figure? (This is usually for long-term engagements rather than single gigs.) Or do you avoid the issue by saying "negotiable" and "depending on budget", etc.? And what resources have helped you come up with your figure?</p> <p>Finally, because I gather this is a common request in the "Real World" of job-seeking, but seems to be unusual for musical jobs, does it raise a red flag at all when a company does ask? As in: "Let's see how cheap we can get this poor sap??" Or, is it a good thing, meaning we can come in ahead and say, "Hey, since you've asked, this is actually the fair market rate for what I do. Let's talk soon!"</p> <p>Just trolling for your thoughts... </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/how-much-should-i-charge-for-accompanying#post-1770 Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:45:53 +0000 David J. Hahn 1770@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>The practice time will be unpaid, sadly, but I guess that's our gig. The better you can sight-read, then, the less you'll have to practice. </p> <p>I'd say $30-35 an hour for rehearsals, $100-150 to play a show. </p> <p>But I guess it also depends on in you are in a city, suburb or rural area. Those rates will suit you in a suburban or semi-rural area in the US. The are, at leat, what I've charged in areas like that. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/how-much-should-i-charge-for-accompanying#post-1756 Wed, 11 Jan 2012 11:50:40 +0000 prattle 1756@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I have been asked to accompany a high school musical, but I do not know what to charge. It will be 31 hours total for rehearsals and performances. In addition to that, there is the preparation/practice time. If anyone has suggestions, I would be very appreciative. Thanks! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1634 Sat, 24 Dec 2011 16:53:29 +0000 karendavis 1634@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I currently play in 4 facilities regularly. Three of these were put in place by an arts agency that I work for; the other one I got myself. As a 'strolling musician' thing (going from floor to floor or room to room) I get $40 per hour. The arts agency set the rate for the first 3 gigs. they also place musicians around the city in other facilities, so I didn't want to undercut them by charging less than they do: everyone who hires me pays a rate comparable to the agency in case word gets back to my employers that I'm 'moonlighting'. </p> <p>If its a more traditional gig (in the day room or the cafeteria; 1 one-hour set) those pay anywhere from $75 - $150, usually coming in at $100.00. I was working with a booking agent for a while, but they only got pay at the low end of that scale; I make more when I don't have to split a fee with an agent. That being said, nursing homes have taken big budgetary hits lately, and some are cutting out entertainment entirely. </p> <p>In any negotiation, start with a figure higher than what you want to get, and let them talk you down. Sometimes, they'll agree to the higher figure and surprise you. That's always nice. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1629 Sat, 24 Dec 2011 02:26:26 +0000 keyz88 1629@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>usicianWages.com Forums» How Much Should I Charge?» Nursing Homes</p> <p>There is no hard and fast general rule for haw much you should charge at a nursing home, assisted care facility, or retirement community. But there are some good indicators... </p> <p>I live in Kansas City (USA, planet Earth) most the time. These rules generally apply across the board and you will kick yourself in the butt for thinking - "duh, we already knew that”. Here's the obvious what we all sometimes forget when determining how much to charge at such facilities. I play piano, so some of these suggestions might be handled differently if you are a guitarist, hula dancer or banjo-playing magician (yes, I know a banjo playing MAGICian). My bad, that last sentence was probably meant for posting on magicianswages.com. </p> <p>Anyway - FIRST GET A LITTLE BACKGROUND INFO before marching into the Vista Pastures Retirement Villas and firing a point-blank shot across their bow with your fees:</p> <p>* Do a little reconnaissance - Do they have a website? If so are there any pictures of past events or of their music performances? Is there a online monthly activity calendar SCHEDULE on the website? Scrolling back a few months (on their online calendar) might show the frequency, type and preferences of activities that the activity director books (FYI: this gig tip works for country club websites too). Be forewarned, if an event is listed as “Doris &amp; Magic Fingers Night... that might just be a nail technician doing manicures (for area retirement homes and) for the members of the place I was at that afternoon – so it was not a musical performance. By the way, Doris was a cute single mid 20's gal that enlightened me on the organizations music preferences... amongst other things. Just to let you know (since I know what you're thinking), Magic Fingers Doris did not play piano. </p> <p>* Do some more reconnaissance – Do you or anyone you know have a friend or relative staying at the venue that you wish to play at? Not only can you talk and visit with them, but you can get a feel for the atmosphere, clientele and overall layout of the place “where” the music acts actually plays at. Do music acts play in a purpose-built auditorium, the lobby or the dining area? That info comes in handy if you are timid when it comes to visiting a new retirement facility for the first time. </p> <p>* Do a little more reconnaissance – Is there also a posted activity calendar on the lobby? There's another listing for Doris and her magic fingers again! My bad, just another Doris flashback. Anyway... I play piano, so if there is a grand piano already there (and in perfect tune)... I know as a fact an acoustic piano does not stay in tune all by itself, it is tuned for a reason. Some cases the piano is not in the best of tune. Either way, even this little fact hints to the possible (or lack of) budget at the place you are thinking of playing for. Sometimes before I talk with the activity director, I can simply talk to the front desk and ask them if anyone ever plays on the grand piano. I introduce myself and get permission to play a quick tune – ask permission so you don't knowingly interrupt any currently scheduled activities (lunch, dinner, guest lecturers, mass escapes or church services already going on at the location). Not only does a quick sample of my playing let the front desk know that I am the real deal, but it is an icebreaker since the front desk will be inclined to ask you a lot of questions about what you do music-wise. I also leave a business card with my website links at the front desk. Activity directors are not the only ones that may want your business card, and potential referrals from anyone are always welcome. </p> <p>* Introductions – Introduce yourself to the Activity Director with a business card and let them know you're interested in playing for them. If you have a website with audio and video samples, be sure to mention that so they can listen to your playing at a later time. I have a songlist of about 200 tunes listed (in printable PDF format) on my website. Although diverse, only a small portion of those songs are geared toward individuals aged 80+. I have an additional (offline) listings of tunes I do for different venues such as retirement homes, Christmas parties, St Patrick Day or the 4th of July. I keep that in mind when I let them know that you can tailor your songlist to their clientele. </p> <p>*Inquire about other musical groups that they have perform there. It could be a mix of volunteers including Christmas carolers, grade school vocal ensembles, jazz guitar soloists, banjo-playing magicians or musical duo acts. Just remember, the “oldies” the residents are familiar with may be tunes like “Sentimental Journey” or “I'm looking Over a 4 Leaf Clover” and may not be the same oldies you or your parents remember (IE: Beach Boys, Van Halen, Duran Duran, Motorhead or James Taylor, Beastie Boys). I remember playing “Against All Odds” on piano after I mentioned that I was going to play an “oldie but a goodie”. One nice lady, albeit very hard of hearing, mentioned in a unassumingly loud voice (as some hard of hearing individuals sometimes do)... “I don't remember that oldie, did Frank Sinatra sing that?” A lesson leaned. I'm sure when that tune came out around 1985 she was only 60 years young. Choose your material to fit your audience, or play something that is instrumental or at least timeless. </p> <p>* When you talk with the activity director in person they will usually let you know what their budget is. Unlike a bar owner, restaurant owner, wedding reception gig client or most other venues, The activity director simply has a budget to work with... so you know it's not directly coming out of their pockets. There are exceptions (of at least 2 places) where the activity director and staff personally and beforehand “kick in” the required money to get certain music acts (booked on a regular basis) because THEY wanted to. BTW – Thanks for the tip Doris, your the best!!! </p> <p>I've made $300.00 (US) for one hours work (instrumental piano tunes) at one place... and then played another place five miles away the week later making only $25.00 an hour (the same instrumental piano tunes). The difference – their budget. Nothing more. If you can't guess what they can afford, then you should simply ask. If you've noticed, playing each month (for 12 months) for $25 at the one place is equal to the just playing one $300 gig at the other place. Both places have a grand piano that I play on, doing a one hour gig. I play them both. </p> <p>Bottom line - I agree with the previous post that mentioned you can always shoot a higher price and have them negotiate it down to an agreeable number. Find out the names and places of nursing homes in your area. And when you've played your first retirement home gig, let the next retirement home facility know you've played there. Just do it. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1525 Tue, 06 Dec 2011 12:56:16 +0000 gabastil 1525@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Thanks for the reply guys!</p> <p>Ok, so I was asking this mainly because I mentioned $75/hr to one of the activity directors at a long term facility and he responded with surprise mentioning how "cheap" and a "good bargain" it was. I have never delved into this field before so I just wanted to make sure I wasn't undercutting other musicians doing it already as well as underselling myself.</p> <p>Thanks again! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/how-much-should-i-charge-as-a-accompaning-guitarist-for-a-solo-artist#post-1519 Mon, 05 Dec 2011 23:56:12 +0000 Cameron Mizell 1519@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I agree with Dave, a flat fee is a great way to go.</p> <p>If you decide to go with a percentage, I'd say 50%. Whatever he makes, you make. If you're friends, that seems completely reasonable and fair.</p> <p>If he's making so much money that half is unreasonable, then your fee should be $300 or so. Cover bands can make a lot of money. If you're getting $100 and he's walking away with $500, you're going to start resenting him and the gig will become a drag. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1517 Mon, 05 Dec 2011 23:35:23 +0000 Cameron Mizell 1517@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Never be afraid to ask for too much! People will negotiate with you if your number is too high. In fact, they'll usually want to negotiate anyway.</p> <p>I'd say your fee is going to depend on the place. When I was a kid, I used to take tap dance lessons and we'd give recitals at some really sad nursing homes. Those places had no money, and our visits were just to make the old folks happy. I've also been to some luxury retirement facilities, where my wives Grandparents lived for a while, and that place could afford to pay live entertainment, and probably paid pretty well. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1512 Mon, 05 Dec 2011 20:52:18 +0000 Andree-Ann 1512@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Hi! Welcome to the forums! </p> <p>I can only speak for myself - have only done one nursing home gig years ago. It paid $50 for the entire morning...huuuuuuh. </p> <p>In my hometown I was invited to do those gigs often but nursing homes will usually expect you to do it for free as a 'good deed'. That was back in a small Canadian town about 8 years ago though. </p> <p>good luck! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/nursing-home-gigs#post-1510 Mon, 05 Dec 2011 17:00:47 +0000 gabastil 1510@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Hey everyone,</p> <p>I'm relatively new to the music scene and wanted to see how much musicians are being paid to perform in nursing homes (if anyone has done that yet).</p> <p>So what's the rate that you've charged?</p> <p>If it helps, I come from the New York City area.</p> <p>Thanks! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1457 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 16:22:10 +0000 Nick Rosaci 1457@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I'm not sure. He did come recommended to me because I am wanting to learn to sing, as it seems more and more bass jobs are requiring that. He's also a bass player, and that may be why he was recommended. Never met the guy, though, and I have no clue about anything except that he is a bass player that does vocal coaching. And he would say he specializes in coaching the Disney singers. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1456 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 16:00:26 +0000 David J. Hahn 1456@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Sounds like New York rates. Does he have any students? Seems exorbitant. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1455 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 15:42:23 +0000 Nick Rosaci 1455@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I charge $40/hour and $25/half hour.</p> <p>There's a vocal coach here that charges $200/hour, and gives a break on a free fourth lesson, if you book the first three and pay up front. He also adds a 50% discount if the student is a Disney performer. So, if I was looking for vocal coaching, I could get 4 lessons for $300. I think he would be the highest paid teacher in town. I don't even think Bill Allred charges that much around here. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/price-for-accompanying-college-student-juries-a-public-school-concert#post-1454 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 15:36:34 +0000 Nick Rosaci 1454@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>When I was at FSU, there was one accompanist who must've had about 100 or so music students every semester for juries. Maybe more (we had about 1,000 music majors). She charged $50 per jury, which, I believe, included one 30 minute rehearsal. So the students knew they better have had their stuff together before said rehearsal. And she knew most of the rep, since she had been doing it for so many years.</p> <p>As for my senior recital, I had done so much copywork for the piano professor, he did the job for free for me, so I guess I lucked out there.</p> <p>You might check out what the nearest local union's going rates for such gigs might be. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/price-for-accompanying-college-student-juries-a-public-school-concert#post-1453 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 13:53:48 +0000 pinklady123 1453@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Thanks! </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1451 Fri, 02 Dec 2011 09:22:39 +0000 jamieryder 1451@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>Over in the UK, i am charging £20 for an hour and £12.50 for 30 minutes.</p> <p>Converted to dollars works out at around $30 and $20 </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/price-for-accompanying-college-student-juries-a-public-school-concert#post-1422 Thu, 01 Dec 2011 01:14:24 +0000 David J. Hahn 1422@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I'm going to give you wild guesses here. I have not idea what the going rate in rural Missouri should be. Back home in suburban Illinois, I would guess the juries gig would pay $50-100. The concert should pay $150-250. </p> <p>Just a guess. Anyone else have thoughts? </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1420 Wed, 30 Nov 2011 19:00:27 +0000 updog14 1420@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>My teacher at my college charges me $20/half an hour. But we always go way over an hour. So its more like $20/hour. </p> <p>Boston, Ma. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/price-for-accompanying-college-student-juries-a-public-school-concert#post-1419 Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:37:00 +0000 pinklady123 1419@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I'm a classically trained pianist and am wondering how much should I should charge to accompany a university music student for their college juries at the end of the semester (2-3 songs) in rural Missouri.</p> <p>Also, what is fair compensation for accompanying a rural public school music program (about 20 songs)? They want me to arrive only the night of the program and two practice sessions (each practice session being 2 hours long). I might add that their regular accompanist is unavailable and I'm a last minute substitute, so I've only been given two weeks notice. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1413 Wed, 30 Nov 2011 09:47:32 +0000 Joe Stone 1413@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>My piano teacher charges $75/hour if you go every two weeks (what I do) or $60/hr if you go every week.</p> <p>Houston, TX. </p> http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/topic/lesson-fees#post-1407 Wed, 30 Nov 2011 01:09:04 +0000 David J. Hahn 1407@http://www.musicianwages.com/forums/ <p>I'm interested in what people are charging for lessons this year. Maybe we can all help each other find the right amount to be charging.</p> <p>Could we take an informal poll?</p> <p>List your location and how much you charge for a 1 hour lesson. Or, if you're taking lessons, list how much your teacher/coach charges you per hour. </p> <p>Here in New York I charge $60/hr for vocal coaching. When I took composition lessons back in 2008 the teacher charged $100/hr.</p> <p>Anyone else? </p>